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Design Ideas for a new GATLIGHT
Hi everyone... we've been playing around with new ideas for a next generation GatLight. Don't hold your breath as most of you know the process from planning to when you finally might hold one of our creations in our hand can easily take a year.
However we would like to start the process for a new design. So here are some renderings and suggestions. Kyle and I basically looked through all of our previously produced lights and there were features we liked about the V1, the V2, the V3 etc.
For example about the V1 we liked the clear and straight lines, not many flares, it was a very timeless design. Also the long V1 were amazing because of the long bars. Gliding your fingers along those extended bars just feels great. So from the V1 we took a more rectangular look, as well as from the long V1 the long bars.
Then from the V1 and V2 we loved the exposed battery, although some felt a bit uncomfortable of having an exposed battery even though the entire package was submersible. As a result the new design is using a transparent sapphire cylinder to expose and protect the battery.
Other things we liked about the V1 and V2 is the slightly reduced diameter compared to the V3. It's not much but it just felt a bit more elegant.
From the V3 and the latest model we like the finish, the user interface, the smooth adjustability and how easy it is to change the battery. The GatLight Titanium (or V4)... we like the gold plated knob threads and the refined rolex knurl of the knob. So our goal was to incorporate all that into a new design.
The thing that changed... is that the screws are less pronounced and protruding instead of sunk in - we kind of preferred them sunk in and larger - like all the previous models have... however that was the price to pay to get smooth long bars, where the bars define the width of the light, the slightly smaller diameter.
Anyway lets discuss.. what are your thoughts on such a gatlight version. Granted it again would be very different to our previous versions so it wouldnt quite replace a GatLight Titanium, but we do think it would be a nice light. Your comments?
However we would like to start the process for a new design. So here are some renderings and suggestions. Kyle and I basically looked through all of our previously produced lights and there were features we liked about the V1, the V2, the V3 etc.
For example about the V1 we liked the clear and straight lines, not many flares, it was a very timeless design. Also the long V1 were amazing because of the long bars. Gliding your fingers along those extended bars just feels great. So from the V1 we took a more rectangular look, as well as from the long V1 the long bars.
Then from the V1 and V2 we loved the exposed battery, although some felt a bit uncomfortable of having an exposed battery even though the entire package was submersible. As a result the new design is using a transparent sapphire cylinder to expose and protect the battery.
Other things we liked about the V1 and V2 is the slightly reduced diameter compared to the V3. It's not much but it just felt a bit more elegant.
From the V3 and the latest model we like the finish, the user interface, the smooth adjustability and how easy it is to change the battery. The GatLight Titanium (or V4)... we like the gold plated knob threads and the refined rolex knurl of the knob. So our goal was to incorporate all that into a new design.
The thing that changed... is that the screws are less pronounced and protruding instead of sunk in - we kind of preferred them sunk in and larger - like all the previous models have... however that was the price to pay to get smooth long bars, where the bars define the width of the light, the slightly smaller diameter.
Anyway lets discuss.. what are your thoughts on such a gatlight version. Granted it again would be very different to our previous versions so it wouldnt quite replace a GatLight Titanium, but we do think it would be a nice light. Your comments?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by ArsMachina on -
Hi,
I am a proud owner of all three types of Gatlights and I have to say that I still love most my V1 :)
It is the smallest and cutest one even it does not have any brightness control.
The V2 had already a brightness control but the UI wasn't really very reliable :)
The UI of the V3 is close to perfect but the light has grown a lot fom it's beginning.
So I really would like to see a V4 which combines all the advantages of the V1 and the V3 !
Jochen
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Permalink Reply by Dave Wise on -
I like the concept of expanding your model line to more than one simultaneous design. This new design looks very interesting. The ability to have exposed innards definitely leaves this light with an elegant steampunk motif. If the rendering is what you are looking for I heartily approve. Are you still looking to utilize a focusing lens instead of a reflector? I like the way that it allows some light to spill out from the sides. Some may see this as a slight negative by possibly interfering with your vision but I doubt it would do enough of that to really cause a problem and it just plain looks cool.
I'll have to think about it for a while to see if I can come up with any suggestions.
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Permalink Reply by Lumencraft1 on -
I know the V2 user interface was just the beginning.. by the way we now have a limited number of V4 drivers to upgrade V2 units... still need to figure out the pricing with Kyle.. but it simply makes the V2 perfect. We've done the upgrade with a unit and this is what the customer had to say:
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Hi Walter, I received my light last Friday, but just got back from a long weekend. It's really an amazing upgrade, so much brighter and easy to operate. I like how the brightness is full on first and then can be brought down by turning the knob in, is the max brightness the very first hint of light that comes on? Thank you again the work you've done, it's a huge improvement, good luck with all your future creations! Thanks, Dan
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So if anyone is interested in a V2 upgrade shoot me an email using the contact form on our webpage.
Regarding the V1.. It was awesome that it was so short... the problem is if you want the knob features (pushbutton) and the variable brightness... the length has to stay what it is.
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Permalink Reply by Dave Wise on
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One question: Have you given any thought to anodizing the Titanium? I have seen some very nice looking colors come from anodized Titanium. The bonus is that no dye is used at all, it's just light refraction/absorption. Some of the best finishes are actually a rainbow effect (like this). Could prove to be an interesting direction to take for the Gatlight.
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Permalink Reply by Lumencraft1 on
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to your questions... yes.. the reason we chose the lens over a reflector is simply performance. We havent found a reflector yet that can project a better hot spot then the lens we are using. Maybe 2% don't like the light spill.. but in the future we might just have an additional piece that could go around the lens.. it's a rather simple part to prevent that.. but personally I do prefer the exposed look too.
Regarding your annodizing titanium question.. yes we've actually started working with someone that is annodizing a customer's gatlight blue.. and I sent him 2 to do whatever... just to see what it looks like...
Something else we've thought about is for this new design to maybe make it out of stainless steel.. the advantage is lower cost.. perfect mirror finish..and by using tubes rather than bars we get about the same weight as using titanium.
We've also changed the knob a little on this design.. to make it easier accessible for ladies with fingernails (we a complaint with the latest model).
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Permalink Reply by Dave Wise on
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Excellent on the Anodizing and lens! Bummer about the knob however. Just looking at aesthetics, I though the Gatlight Ti was about the nicest knob that I have ever seen. I have had it with standard knurling on everything and it has started looking like just a cop out instead of innovation. The last one looked fantastic milled like that.
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Permalink Reply by Lumencraft1 on
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Oh let me clarify the KNOB even of this new design will be like the one in the GATLIGHT TITANIUM... so its not the V3 knob features here.. it will be the Rolex knurl knob.. except the inside is a bit wider and more rectangular.. sorry forgot to clarify that.. no that knob on the V4 (Gatlight Titanium) looks good... so we won't change that knurl...
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Permalink Reply by Thermionic on -
Ok, yet more variations on a theme of bars…
I rather liked the idea of the Polaris, in that you had a fairly conventional body with the V3 interface and just a touch of the exotic with the electronics behind that Sapphire tube. This seemed a new and rather unique direction to go in. As I have my doubts about creating yet another variation on bars and tubes. Would the no doubt significant cost if this latest iteration create enough fresh interest and new Lumencraft customers? IMHO one of the best aspect of the V3 Gatlight is the simple and effective user interface. Would it not be better to use this in something new?
My understanding was that the original reason for the bars was to ’improve’ heat sinking for the LEDS then in use, but as materials (use of Titanium) and led technology improved this configuration seems to have become somewhat moot. I suppose there is an argument for staying with the original USP, but for someone like myself who looks more for the unusual and clever in lights, it is unlikely that I would go for yet another variation on titanium and bars. ‘Been there done that.’ as it were, and anyway this latest proposal seems to use the bars / tubes just to hold the torch together and seems to provide even less heat sinking. So I suppose you are just aiming at existing customers and collectors with this one.
While I greatly like my V3 as an object of desire and something pleasingly tactile to fondle. While it is a very nice thing I have never actually used it as a serious EDC light, mostly because it doesn’t have a clip or a proper lanyard fixing point (yes I know that you can strap something around the bars, but that is hardly in keeping with the image of the light). I rather hoped that you would have introduced by now a really nicely engineered clip / lanyard ring that perhaps would fit over two or three bars between the light engine flange and the front ring. Something machined in solid Ti with a spring loaded clip, and I even thought of having a go at making something myself, but life is a bit short.
And of course these days there are many brighter, smaller and cheaper lights out there to EDC. The Nitecore I use at the moment is almost cheap enough to be thought of as disposable. I know you regard the Gatlight as the ’Rolex’ of flashlights, and it is indeed up there with the best, but as any watch enthusiast will tell you, there are very many better watches out there than Rolex., think IWC, Lange & Sohne etc, etc.
So after my little rant what would I like to see in a new Gat, er sorry Lumencraft light? Well you should keep the excellent and simple user interface back end, find or design an efficient means of getting a good beam out the front. Something that gives a light picture as nice as say my ARC4 or HDS, which means using a reflector. Fine on having the latest LED technology, highly finished exotic materials and a Sapphire window to show the insides, but make the overall form simple, ergonomic and elagent, and above all lacking in any form of unnecessarry ornimentation or ‘bling‘. Provide the best engineered clip and lanyard fixing in the business, and a best quality leather holster with good fasteners. Oh, and put it all in a nice wooden box that the paint won’t fall off this time.
Simple! - but then we might indeed have an IWC of flashlights!
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Permalink Reply by ArsMachina on
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Hello Thermionic,
there are some interesting points in your posting.
For the Gatlight / Polaris discussion I believe we are just talking about personal tastes.
For me the Gatlight with it's bars is just the most beautiful light I have ever seen.
The Polaris in my eyes would only have been an "ordinary" flashlight like many others out there which are performing better.
So I am buying a Gatlight only because of it's design and not because of it's performance.
I also never used a gatlight as regulary EDC for several reasons:
The V1 would be small enough for EDCing but it has only on/off, isn't too bright at - so it is way timed out compared to modern lights.
The V2 is no flesh no fish, I only keep one for collecting reasons to have the complete Gatlight line.
The V3 has variable brightness and is bright enough for an EDC light - but it is also rather big and heavy.
When I take a Gatlight with me in my pocket for special events where I like to have an extravagant light with me, it is always and only the V1 because for me this is the most beautiful of all and will probably be forever.
Sure the UI of the V3 is a big improvement over the V2 and probably there is no more room for big improvements.
For a long time I thought continious brightness by turning one part of the light screwed into the other part of the light is the best solution one can imagine.
Theoretical this is true because that UI is self explaining and easy to use even by someone who holds the light in his hands for the first time.
But unfortunately there are mechanical issues which one cannot handle for 100%
There will always be some play in the threads and the very little way of just parts of a millimeter from zero to hundred are making some troubles. The brightness is never reproducable, if you put some pressure on the knob the brightness changes, when you have set a brightness it even changes a littlle bit by doing so you need to change it again.
This is the reason why I am no longer thinking this is the optimal UI for a flashlight.
The optimal UI is something as it is provided by the Spy flashlights.
Also a turning knob, but with well definated stops which are always giving the similar brightness.
Sure you are only having 6 diferent steps of brightness, but for my taste this really is enough when the current settings are choosen well...
Sure I would like to see a small and most beautiful light in combination with the best UI on the market and for sure highest brightness of all lights using the same battery size.
But I believe another switch would be necessary as this design of "pushing the battery forward with a thread" can probably not be improved any further Walter and Kyle already did the optimum that is possible.
Jochen
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Permalink Reply by Dave Wise on
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I tend to disagree with you as well there Thermionic. The barred design of the Gatlight is what sets it apart from every other light on the market. This new design is an effort to make a smaller diameter light and change up the looks a little from the standard line.
As far as the Spy series interface, didn't one of the previous versions of the Gatlight offer the option of having several spring loaded retainer beads in place for better locating prescribed brightnesses? Wouldn't this be basically what you are asking for? I personally don't know anything about the play in the threads or minute brightness changes due to pressure though since I have not had the privilege of using one of these masterpieces yet. I imagine though that with enough precision, the threading can become fairly play-less. Doesn't the V4 have the option of setting the brightness and just using the clicky switch to manage the power allowing better retention of your brightness value? Please correct any misunderstandings that I have.
Dave
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Permalink Reply by Lumencraft1 on
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Ok time to reply the feedback...
Thermionic - Polaris
Well first let me post the Polaris Renderings for those who don't know what the Polaris design was.
A cylindrical shaped light with a sapphire window revealing the electronics..
Other options would be blue tint
Wood instead of sapphire
Leather
or just plain black
http://gatlight.com/hosted/polaris-1-001.jpg
I think ArsMachina's post sums it up... I do have to say looking at the Polaris it would be an interesting light... but at the end it is still just another cylindrical light... sure the GatLight is another light with bars... however I understand that it is an evolution of an existing.... we've been thinking about shrinking everything to a AAA diameter... the problem is that the light would be a lot thinner, but it would be almost equally long.. which would change the look a lot.
Regarding the play in the threads... that is actually a feature..believe it or not and purposely done that way. With the V3 we first noticed that when the threads are machined more losely, that this adds a momentary dim feature. And we've had feedback from cops/bouncers who liked the option to have the light set at a higher brightness level to search a car, or shine a light on someone's body, then when shining the light into someone's face to just push the rim of the knob (not the center switch) and get a temporary dim. The dim is not something that can happen accidentially.. or when the light is standing on it's back. The only drawback is if you push for permanent on/off the light dims down a bit.. which we found is ok, since if you do that you are looking for a permanent anyway so dimming while pressing for a second should nto be an issue..
So as a result we left that feature. It would easy to remove it, but we find it adds value... Also the ORing ads stability where the lose threads only are noticed when one pushes onto the back of the knob.
What are you opinions... would you want the threads tigher and lose the momentary dim feature (don't think any other light has that currently). Or leave it as is.
The entire light is machined on 2 Mio dollar Aerospace High Precision Machines... trust us every thousands of an inch is planned and modeled up and purposely done that way. Many manufacturers do their lights in their own shops or less well equipped shops where you can accidentally end up with lose threads. Not here, but again its something we can change if that feature is not desired (regardless of what light will be next).
Regarding a clip for the GatLight - well we've looked into that.. and if you look at the design it pretty much impossible to do without destroying the symmetry. Ideally would be to make it optional but that is even less an option. The back has virtually no space to do anything.. unless we get rid of the permanent knob.
Regarding brighter and cheaper lights... well at the end you need to compare apples with apples. If you talk brighter not measured in Lumens but hotspot brightness (because that's how layman people judge brightness) I'd want to see a 1 x123 cell light that beats the current version's overdrive mode -don't think there are many lights out there that are brighter (comparing with other 1 cell lights).
Cheaper, yes of course.
The LED is $10... making 3 machined aluminum lathe parts light costs less than $10 in production. However making a 20 machined metal parts light (almost half the parts in Titanium) costs a whole lot more. If you look around you see 4 me
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